Episode 8: "Common Threads" Options

[MicrowaveHo]

ZOMGZ is it Wed. yet? Today I was actually fascinated by a show on the history channel about the evolution of corn!!!!

Go ahead... ask me anything about corn... I am a semi-hobbling encyclopedia on the subject now.

[MicrowaveHo]

WAJ,
I have to agree with you on this one - Otto did get hosed. The lychees were on the bottom tray of Elia's shopping cart when Elia was at the cash register. Otto was at the rear of the line with an unidentified customer between him and Elia. In the next scene Otto is coming out of the market pushing Elia's cart and while loading the contents of the cart into the back of the SUV Otto makes the announcement that the lychees were not paid for. How does he know that since it was Elia who supposedly paid for what was on her shopping cart. If the cashier did not ring up the lychees on Elia's cart, it seems to me that Elia was responsible for the error, not Otto.

Yeah but the point being that Otto kNEW the lychees wern't paid for. In my mind this makes him a shop-lifter.

If there is something at the bottom of your cart that you aren't going to lift up to the cashiers awareness, or at least tell them about, and then you knew that they weren't paid for: that makes you a shoplifter.

He knew it when they had left the store, which gave him time to go back & pay for them. I hold Marissa just as responsible... as she knew it when he told her, yet she didn't go back & pay for them.

[SimonBao]

He never mentioned it being rigged
either or that he dislikes Tom or felt it was unfair.....Funny.... few do.

Nice guy though...Nice exit...A good way to go.

About Mark using rice, and asserting that the use of rice therefore makes his dish a complete protein...

All I know about the first part is that the show didn't let us see Mark making rice, serving rice, or anyone eating any rice. And Mark is the one who plated his dish, and the Camera Photo of his dish doesn't have any rice.

But let's leave that aside for a moment...

Adding rice to the dish doesn't do what Mark asserts it does. And a chef asserting something wildly wrong still makes me want to make him PYKAG.

Rice, or any cereal grain, is Protein Magic only when it is served along with either 1) a protein that is already complete on its own, such as an egg or piece of fish or meat or dairy, or 2) a protein-rich legume.

Add all the rice you want to a dish, make it whole grain rice if you want, you still do not have a healthy, nutritious, meal. Combine the rice with a whole wheat bread of some kind, you haven't gotten any closer to your goal. You've just increased the total quantity of missing essential amino acids.

Whether there was rice or not, Gail and other judges are still correct and Mark's "meal" didn't offer any complete protein. If he'd offered some kind of hummus or fuul or other beany, leguminous substance to go with his Naan bread, he'd be good. Put some edamame into the curry, he'd be good. The dish wouldn't taste better but it wouldn't taste any worse either.

With or without rice, Mark got it all quite wrong....

[SimonBao]

You know.

Oh LAWD here I go...I know you and Simon and the rest aren't followers ....But let let me tell you something sistah girl....I watched on this very board peeps hate Marcel and Hung before the show started...BEFORE!!!

They may have started early on the hate, but I wasn't reading that stuff... and don't know that Board-Hate is indicative of much.

Even so, I'd be surprised if attitudes toward Hung were really similar to those toward Marcel. Hung said annoying things. Things his mom would be upset to see and hear. He did a few odd things now and then, but not big issues. But throughout, he delivered the dishes. He quite often backed up his high opinion of himself. But nothing he did provoked others, annoyed others, distracted others, insulted others, or made anyone else feel creeped out. Or made others want to knock him into the middle of next week. Granted, Hung made no effort to have any kind of relationship with the other chefs but in the end they all seem to have accepted that, and still got on well with him.

None of that describes Marcel, how Marcel behaved, how Marcel was perceived.

And I say that as someone who rode Hung's ass all last season for the things he said.

[SimonBao]

Season 2 may have been the overall "Season of Bad Behavior," if you are looking at the large number of cheftestants who exhibited pathetically bad behavior at least once.

KS, for me S2 was also memorable, for me, for that Holiday Spirits episode... the one where Mia said (and howled) so many inexplicable things that my jaw was dropped for the final 15 minutes. Nasty overall, uber-nasty towards Cliff, and no amount of provocation justifies that kind of talk. Invoking some kind of unconventional personal history as... well I still don't know what her background had to do with anything pertaining to that challenge or her performance.

For me, so far, S4 is the overall "Season of Truly Disappointing Cooking." And so far, "Not Very Interesting Challenges."

[SimonBao]

What else would they use the money for? In the opening, Padme says "And $100,000 to make their culinary dreams a reality".

Siva, I think it's entirely possible, or likely, that a Top Chef winner will do something else with their $100K prize, not necessarily open a restaurant with it.

After taxes, that $100K prize will be severely reduced in value, and will not represent much of the capital needed to open a restaurant. The title of winner, and the media attention that comes with that, will help a chef raise the rest of the needed capital - but the cash prize itself won't get you a much of a restaurant.

Harold did use his win to open Perilla, which seems to still succeed. Hung is reported to be opening his own place within a month or so. But I haven't heard anything about Ilan turning his cash prize into a restaurant.

It's possible that Harold and Hung have both long dreamt of becoming the Total Restauranteur. Chef/owner of a place. It's almost always a chef/owner who achieves "Celebrity Chef Status." But some chefs want nothing to do with owning and running a restaurant.

I think it would be reasonable for a chef to take whatever is leftover of the $100K after taxes, and use it for a year of travel and study. Whether your passion is French cuisine, or Greek, or Caribbean, Vietnamese, Mexican, Tex-Mex, New Orleans... follow your passion. Travel, visit, stay, study, take classes there, work in some kitchens for brief stints.

[SimonBao]

Hung is currently Executive Chef at a glatt kosher restaurant in New York. He had no clue about Kashruth and Jews before he was hired, so he's been getting quite the education. He did his first Passover food and brought a bunch of new twists to the traditional fare.

Doga, from what I read, Hung took the job at the Kosher restaurant for only a brief two month stint. He has his own restaurant moving on track and on schedule for opening in the near future.

I missed going to a Seder this year, but I've been to a number of Seders before. I would LOVE to see Hung do a Seder. For him, that would be a bit like a Top Chef challenge. A number of detailed rules and prescriptions and proscriptions, things you can do, things you can't, things you're almost obliged to do... but in the end, abide by the challenge and put out great food.

I'd like someone to interview Hung and find out if he thought that was fun.

[Fordmanrod]

They may have started early on the hate, but I wasn't reading that stuff... and don't know that Board-Hate is indicative of much.

Even so, I'd be surprised if attitudes toward Hung were really similar to those toward Marcel. Hung said annoying things. Things his mom would be upset to see and hear. He did a few odd things now and then, but not big issues. But throughout, he delivered the dishes. He quite often backed up his high opinion of himself. But nothing he did provoked others, annoyed others, distracted others, insulted others, or made anyone else feel creeped out. Or made others want to knock him into the middle of next week. Granted, Hung made no effort to have any kind of relationship with the other chefs but in the end they all seem to have accepted that, and still got on well with him.

None of that describes Marcel, how Marcel behaved, how Marcel was perceived.

And I say that as someone who rode Hung's ass all last season for the things he said.

Simon... I have to agree with you here... Marcel annoyed me from episode 1 when he asked Ilan if he wanted to see his knives.... he came off like the classroom geek that wanted to be part of the group but always (and I mean always) managed to piss everyone off. Was he a bad person.... probably not but I think Sam hit on the head when he called him an annoying gnat that just kept buzzing around.

[SimonBao]

Simon .....I think you are brilliant and
kind and just great...But for you to say he was disgusting??? I mean disgusting???
PUCK?????

Puck was GROSS.....Mikey was gross
Marcel was never gross.
Not in his personal habits or to anyone.
I think bullies are disgusting...Listen to Harold.
Walk away...Bullies make me sick and they were bullies.

Kristl, when I say I found Marcel's behavior and attitude disgusting, I'm not talking about any of his personal hygiene habits.

When I compare Marcel to Puck, I'm not using personal habits as the basis for the comparison. I compare Marcel to Puck because I suspect that the people who cast both of them for reality shows knew in advance they would annoy, offend, or provoke other cast members. And that would be the drama the Reality Show Demons always seek.

Take Step It Up and Dance. The dancer who looks like he was separated at birth from The Artist Formerly Known as Prince. I don't know the dancer's name, I just refer to him as The Artist Formerly Known as Princess. Does anyone imagine that person is a better dancer and performed better in audition than all the others who auditioned? Or, was that person cast because the exotic behavior would be good tv? The attitude that annoys and offends and provokes others would be good tv?

That's the basis of the comparison. I have no interest in Mikey's hygiene or personal habits.

This post has been edited by SimonBao: May 6, 2008 - 07:51 AM

[SimonBao]

Speaking of Hung Cooking Kosher, and celebrating Passover with some Seders...

Here is a recent Daily News article, "Top Chef Hung Huynh Has a Lot on His Seder Plate."

Read the article all the way to Page 2, and you'll find Hung's recipe for a Touch 'o' Vietnam Matzoh Ball Soup, one that comes with non-Matzoh Balls. And Hung's Touch 'o' Vietnam Gefilte Fish.

Now this is the stuff I love about food...

"OK, but just pretend for a minute that Vietnamese DID keep kosher... just go along with it for a moment... if Viets DID keep kosher, if we had been the ones to invent Jewish cooking, what would our Matzoh Ball Soup look like? What would our Gefilte Fish look like?"

This post has been edited by SimonBao: May 6, 2008 - 08:02 AM

[actor59]

Morning all!!!

Not sure if any of you read Kanni's Karma Kitchen Blog ..... if you don't you should.... but not sure if it was Kanni or her blogging partner decided too try and recreate the $10 for 4 challenge.

She shopped at Whole Foods ..oh she picked Nicky's dish the roasted chicken and veggies.... so at Whole Foods she could not afford a Whole Chicken and opted for Legs and Thighs... she bought Roma Tomatoes instead of the other Grape Tomatoes? anyway she got the veggies and the fresh herbs and it came to over $20... so much for $10...

Next she went to a cheaper store and tried the same challenge and it came too just shy of $13..... so much for $10 again...

I knew this challenge was bogus especially at Whole -Paychecks...

This post has been edited by actor59: May 6, 2008 - 08:46 AM

[Fordmanrod]

You know what Ford..Marcel says Ilan acted all nice to him right then but then went into confessional and dissed him.
What is so wrong about saying you want to see my knives????

To a chef knives are everything...My hubby slept with his......And not to ward me off either
Not really but he treasured them and talked of them all the time to his chef buds...Always on the hunt for the perfect knife.

YES ... Ilan thought that was stupid as Ilan wasn't
and isn't a food geek.
Did he take it all very seriously???
I dunno' .....Marcel never drank.
He said he wouldn't mess up his chances to win.

How in GOD'S name you all don't see the others as annoying also is a mystery to me.
OK Marcel was annoying I never thought
so..... but OK he was.

BUT

Marcel was the ONLY one who was annoying???
They didn't show you that Frank would NOT stop singing opera....LOUD!!!
Mikey HATED it and so did others.

The Magical Elves needed a villian and they manufactured one...They goaded it and they
ended up almost getting sued because of it.

They set it all up..the editing so by the time the head shaving thing happened...you thought he DID deserve it...That I will buy!!!!

JMNSOHO!!!!

KK... I never said that I didn't think others in that cast were annoying (to Me).... ; if I had to work with Mikey I probably would kill him because he presents a real "I don't care attitude".... I have never understood why you women were hot to trot about Sam.... he always struck me as kind of greasy; did I think Ilan was a weasel .. you bet. Was Marcel the victim of TC editing.... probably... but I think Marcel's natural "attitude " help put him in the position and role on that cast that he assumed. He may be the nicest guy in the world in real life and I hope he is but as he was presented to me and how I saw him portrayed he struck me as the annoying geeky kid that gets stuffed into lockers and trash cans at school.

[SecondTry]

But Jim...You are forgetting one really nice perk of a guy like Marcel.

All you can eat foam!!!
(Hide your eyes Radys )

Isn't there a Longo's Steakhouse or somoz in
NY...I was sure there was...You ever get out to City Island for the clams??? Anna's??? We went there every Mother's Day...Do you know the Bronx at all??? How many questions can I ask in one post???? If you do..... I got questions.

If not Marcel's restaurant will be called

*Foaming In The Mouth*

I don't visit the Bronx much, so no, I've never heard of either of those places........any good?

[SimonBao]

Morning all!!!

Not sure if any of you read Kanni's Karma Kitchen Blog ..... if you don't you should.... but not sure if it was Kanni or her blogging partner decided too try and recreate the $10 for 4 challenge.

She shopped at Whole Foods ..oh she picked Nicky's dish the roasted chicken and veggies.... so at Whole Foods she could not afford a Whole Chicken and opted for Legs and Thighs... she bought Roma Tomatoes instead of the other Grape Tomatoes? anyway she got the veggies and the fresh herbs and it came to over $20... so much for $10...

Next she went to a cheaper store and tried the same challenge and it came too just shy of $13..... so much for $10 again...

I knew this challenge was bogus especially at Whole -Paychecks...

Actor, I do believe this is another case where the program producers have their heads up their kitchen exhausts.

If they'd been willing to do ONE episode that wasn't about shopping at Whole Foods, they could have unleashed the Chefs into Sav-a-Lot, Aldi's, or whatever chain of discount supermarkets is found in Chicago.

If you want to produce a meal for $10, produce it the real way. The way real Americans do. By purchasing your stuff at a discount supermarket chain. That would have made the episode a good deal more interesting to watch, as that's not where professional chefs shop for their stuff...

[teleburst]

Morning all!!!

Not sure if any of you read Kanni's Karma Kitchen Blog ..... if you don't you should.... but not sure if it was Kanni or her blogging partner decided too try and recreate the $10 for 4 challenge.

She shopped at Whole Foods ..oh she picked Nicky's dish the roasted chicken and veggies.... so at Whole Foods she could not afford a Whole Chicken and opted for Legs and Thighs... she bought Roma Tomatoes instead of the other Grape Tomatoes? anyway she got the veggies and the fresh herbs and it came to over $20... so much for $10...

Next she went to a cheaper store and tried the same challenge and it came too just shy of $13..... so much for $10 again...

I knew this challenge was bogus especially at Whole -Paychecks...

Let's not forget a couple of things. First of all, Nikki's recipe is for 8 people and, in fact, that's what they shopped for (4 for the kids and 4 for the judges). So, your costs are spread out a little more than if you try to buy stuff for only four people (as a single guy, I feel this phenomenon even more strongly). So, if she was trying to shop for ingredients for only 4 people, I can see how it might be impossible.

The other thing we need to keep in mind is that food prices have gone up fairly steeply in the past 6 months (especially for such a short time frame). Tomatoes especially have gotten quite expensive and apples seem to have even gone up.

So, it's not necessarily bogus. Plus, I have to think that even Whole Foods marks stuff like close to expiration date chicken parts down and perhaps that helped as well. Obviously I don't know this for sure, but I know that when I shop at Kroger, which isn't Whole Foods of course, I can almost always buy a pack of drum and thighs for 8 discounted to around $7 - $8 simply because its time was near. I don't ever buy them since I buy whole chickens for the freezer (a whole chicken at Kroger runs around $4 - $5 - once again, not Whole Foods).

Just more quick food for thought before I have to dash to work.

[actor59]

Actor, I do believe this is another case where the program producers have their heads up their kitchen exhausts.

If they'd been willing to do ONE episode that wasn't about shopping at Whole Foods, they could have unleashed the Chefs into Sav-a-Lot, Aldi's, or whatever chain of discount supermarkets is found in Chicago.

If you want to produce a meal for $10, produce it the real way. The way real Americans do. By purchasing your stuff at a discount supermarket chain. That would have made the episode a good deal more interesting to watch, as that's not where professional chefs shop for their stuff...

Yup Simon your right...... I have shopped at Whole Foods but even their cheeses are sometimes not under $10..... On one Board not sure wich one of the posters said the register said $52 and some cents when Antonia was trying to get the bachow down under budget.... so either they were given a ceiling say at $40 and that being $10 a person and then given a discount maybe that would make more sense to me.

But if only $10 then no way in hell could any of the contestans come up with a dish.

JMHO

[SimonBao]

Yup Simon your right...... I have shopped at Whole Foods but even their cheeses are sometimes not under $10..... On one Board not sure wich one of the posters said the register said $52 and some cents when Antonia was trying to get the bachow down under budget.... so either they were given a ceiling say at $40 and that being $10 a person and then given a discount maybe that would make more sense to me.

But if only $10 then no way in hell could any of the contestans come up with a dish.

JMHO

Ya know, Actor... when BRAVO did "Top Design," a very close clone of "Top Chef," they had one of the production crew blogging every week, and providing all kinds of detail that viewers might have wanted to know about.

Lee Anne *could* do that, but really almost never does. But perhaps they could someone else in the production crew to do that. Add detail about the challenge and the context and who's told what and what info people are given and what really goes on that there's no time to show us...

[actor59]

Let's not forget a couple of things. First of all, Nikki's recipe is for 8 people and, in fact, that's what they shopped for (4 for the kids and 4 for the judges). So, your costs are spread out a little more than if you try to buy stuff for only four people (as a single guy, I feel this phenomenon even more strongly). So, if she was trying to shop for ingredients for only 4 people, I can see how it might be impossible.

The other thing we need to keep in mind is that food prices have gone up fairly steeply in the past 6 months (especially for such a short time frame). Tomatoes especially have gotten quite expensive and apples seem to have even gone up.

So, it's not necessarily bogus. Plus, I have to think that even Whole Foods marks stuff like close to expiration date chicken parts down and perhaps that helped as well. Obviously I don't know this for sure, but I know that when I shop at Kroger, which isn't Whole Foods of course, I can almost always buy a pack of drum and thighs for 8 discounted to around $7 - $8 simply because its time was near. I don't ever buy them since I buy whole chickens for the freezer (a whole chicken at Kroger runs around $4 - $5 - once again, not Whole Foods).

Just more quick food for thought before I have to dash to work.

Tele I can see your point but I think your streching it lol.... too me any way the challenge is $10 for 4 people not 8. I think the judges get food only from the challenge not extra food cooked for them... we have what 8 or 9 contestants still cooking and I think they plate the food acordingly to however many dishes are needed that is why to me any way the portions are so small.

I could be wrong cause I have read where Leann has tasted each dish as well from the contestants... so who knows how much food each of them have to prepare for everyone involved?

I do cook as well on a budget and yes I can make a great dish for 2 anyway well under $10 but not by shopping at Whole Foods.... lol

Jenn and I Treated ourselves one day to a great steak from Whole foods that we were going to split and that steak even though it was a great peice of meat still cost us $15.... that was one item. Don't get me wrong I'm not saying one can not cook a great meal for $10..... I do it all the time. But from Whole Foods No way.

[WhataJoke]

I'm pretty darned sure he used white rice since that's what it looked like and I've never really heard of brown rice being used for coconut rice (I'm sure somewhere in the universe has done it, but it's not a likely combination). If he did it, then bully for him for keeping some of the vitamins and minerals, but it wasn't all that necessary, what with the sweet potato and all. And I don't know how much brown rice you've eaten, or how much coconut milk you've cooked with, but the two don't really go together all that well, so, on the very off chance that he did do it, it probably tasted like something you'd feed to your dogs before the Ititerod.

Yes, a little protein was added Just so you know, a cup of coconut milk, which has 550 calories, has 5.5 grams of protein. A cup, which will make a large amount of Thai soup, unfortunately also has 55 grams of fat. To make four servings of rice, you need far less than a cup of coconut milk, so, you really don't get that much protein per serving (fortunately, you get less fat as well). And even then, you have to look at percentages as well. It's all fine and good to get some protein (5.5 g of protein, especially when divided by a number larger than 4, isn't all that much, especially when the fat content is 10 times the amount of protein.

Sweet potato is cherished for its vitamins, minterals and carbs, but not for its protein. Yes, it has a little protein. But it would take 4 whole raw sweet potatoes to equal the protein in 100 grams of a 450 calorie Snickers bar. One whole raw sweet potato has about as much protein as two miniature Reese's peanut butter cups. You know, the kind that look like tiny thimbles.

Maybe we've hit on a kid friendly curry dish. Curried peanut butter cups with a glass of milk. We can do that for under $10 for a family of four.

You know for a guy who went out of his way to find out about amino acids in white rice you really dropped the ball ont he fats in coconut Milk. I mentioned it before there are so many suspected and proven benefits to it that there is ongoing medical research being done on them and there has been in the past.

http://www.templeofthai.com/cooking/coconu...cholesterol.php

For instance, a study in 1981 showed that islanders with high intakes of coconut oil showed "no evidence of the high saturated fat intake having a harmful effect in these populations". When these groups migrated to New Zealand, however, and lowered their intake of coconut oil, their total cholesterol and LDL cholesterol increased, and their HDL cholesterol decreased.

One possible reason that the saturated fat in coconut had no harmful effect on the islanders, Dr. Enig proposes, is the lauric acid. Approximately 50% of the fatty acids in coconut fat are lauric acid. Lauric acid is a medium chain fatty acid, found naturally in mother's milk. Lauric acid has the beneficial function of being formed into monolaurin in the body. Monolaurin is the antiviral, antibacterial, and antiprotozoal monoglyceride used by the body to destroy lipid-coated viruses such as HIV, herpes, and influenza.

Sounds exactly like a bad fat to me.

After Tom and Co. slip up with the Lobster last season he should stay away from arguing about health benefits.

And again we are talking about the dish as part of a healthy diet and I think it certainly qualifies. Considering there is not a shortage or concern with children lacking protien in their diets I find the protein argument to be a red herring to get rid of a contestant.

[actor59]

Ya know, Actor... when BRAVO did "Top Design," a very close clone of "Top Chef," they had one of the production crew blogging every week, and providing all kinds of detail that viewers might have wanted to know about.

Lee Anne *could* do that, but really almost never does. But perhaps they could someone else in the production crew to do that. Add detail about the challenge and the context and who's told what and what info people are given and what really goes on that there's no time to show us...

Simon there is one of the Blogs here TC that dose that it is written by SuperFan who is one of the editors on Bravo. He said reagarding Step's dish that Tom hated it but the guest judge loved it so he thought that was why she got a pass this time..... sometimes Leann gives a few insights about the going ons but mostly about the pantry and the personalities of the chefs. I like the idea of someone trying to atleast explain about the challenge and what it really dose contain.
Hell even Tom's blog makes it seem that all the contestants achieved the $10 challenge.
Maybe I'm over thinking this too much... .... it is just entertainment after all.