SHUT YOUR MOUTH! You did NOT just say you met Martina! Ahhhhhh............... You know she's my icon of all icons and you know she's also a bit catty. She doesn't like Sharapova AT ALL and has made some controversial but freaking HILARIOUS remarks about her. Martina is as real as they get....... big sigh.............. love her.

Hey Liam, How do you comment on someone's post without having the whole thing show back up. Truereality answers just sections of a post right there under what they have said and I was just curious how to do that. Any idea?

Well, I'm the golfer in the relationship and Alex is the tennis star. Yes I met her and she seemed very nice. Her girlfriend is very funny. She was funny too. I think it helped that I didn't really know who she was at first. In our house we have photos of our families, our wedding, all of our pets and a hugh 11 by 16 of Alex with all her tennis buddies with Martina. Guess who had to take the picture?

Hello all,

For the sake of ….well for Fantasy’s sake, I’ve been thinking about my idea of the ideal “Work Out” type show.

Some of the ideas are silly “fantasy/Peyton Place stuff” and some of them are genuine suggestions… Anyway, I hope it brings a smile to someone’s face.



#1. Do ONE episode called “You come to the gym”. In which the camera angle is completely from the “Client’s” point of view. It would begin with JW (or other gym owner) meeting with the “Client” and asking the battery of questions. Then the tour of the gym, the tour of the trainers…the “view” from the treadmill…some progress made during a reasonable amount of time.



#2 During an unprecedented Power-grab, Arnold Swartzenagger (or maybe Lou Ferrigno) takes over the Gym from Jackie Warner, but because of contract issues, Jackie Warner has to stay on as a trainer!

*--ok, I know Lou Ferigno tells my age…sorry gang.



#3- Each and every episode of Work Out includes two “tip-spots”. (during or as they’re going to commercial break). One is one of the trainers doing an exercise (demonstrating an exercise) and then showing a client trying the exercise and touting the value of that particular exercise.

The second “tip” is a more generalize fitness tip. Example: What is a pedometer? Or some of the values of some of the “home fitness equipment” like the fitness ball. Or “Don’t gulp down water when you’re over-heated after a workout”. (etc…)



#4 “Internal Punishment”…During the last episode there was an incident where Greg Plitt crossed the line of “acceptable behavior” (during the retreat). In his Blog , Jessie Blume mentioned that he believed it was over the line as well. I think it might be interesting if the trainers had a say when they also believe a colleague goes “over the line”. (During the first season, Rebecca showed a lewd pic on her phone to a client and fellow trainers at Sky Sport. Some trainers and Jackie Warner thought it was “out of place”).

Anyway, my idea is this…when an issue like this arises, fellow trainers have “spankable offense” cards that they can give to their Trainer-in-offense. So the trainers can come up with some sort of “punishment” for the offender. Something like “bench-press 20 extra reps” or “buy us all lunch” or “make a youtube video explaining the proper use of a condom” (hope that doesn’t offend anyone!).



#5 GYM-OGraphies. During the season, do episodes that focus on the trainers giving “more history”. When did they begin working out? What did they look like before they worked out. Why did they become a trainer? What is their routine when they’re being “disciplined? Where do they actually hope to go with their career? How does their history benefit their client. I realize we get bits and pieces of this now, but would like something more focused.



#6 Ménage’ a Troi?? During this episode, both Erika and Rebecca join Greg Plitt for a photo shoot for a fitness magazine. During the shoot and the days following, Erika and Rebecca realize they have feelings for each other and they adopt Greg Plitt as their submissive love-slave. In a short amount of time they are given their own Bravo show, exploring the world of polyamory called “Just the three of us”.



#7 (I’m not going to make a lot of friends with this one) Brian Peeler joins a 12-step program, and goes into “Iron Man training”. He places in Iron Man competition. Next season, the entire work out team (and Brian Peeler, Andre Zen and Jackie Warner) all place third (or above) in the “Mud-run”.



#8 The Trainers training impossible clients. What I mean by this, is; Sky Sport is supposed to be one of the “gyms to the stars”. What if Gregg (with the dreds) were to have an appointment with Paris Hilton. She can’t do the machines because she doesn’t want to “chip her nails”. Or Daria (yes, the cartoon from MTV) decides to address her self-image issues, and ends up training with Erika? Or –To get a better idea what clients go through, Lisa is given the task (as a condition of her employment) to be trained by EACH of the Sky Sport trainers—through out the course of a season.



#9 (this would be a season finale episode) Jackie Warner falls in love with a woman who is relatively stable and slightly rubinesque. During the season finale, she and her rubinesque-goddess-girlfriend have a “location wedding” in Hawaii. JW’s little dog is a ring-bearer. In lieu of wedding presents, they request donations be given to the Doug Bladesdale Foundation. Jessie Brune opens a “Juice Bar” in Sky Sport.

[/size]

[size="3"]That's all folks....

Gypsy in Fl

I love golf as well. When things get stressful, I hit balls... my husband knows this and one day he was looking for me so he went to the golf course, as he walked up to the driving range, one of the guys working there said, 'man, your wife is really dedicated.' I'm sure my husband was like, 'no, she's just pissed.'

Speaking of tennis, I just bought the Wimbledon DVD , Changing of the Guard for my husband. I watched the doc on a flight overseas a while back and it's really great. Check it out. I've been looking for some Martina documentaries but haven't found any available on DVD.

The thing is, the anti gay thing for me does not exist. It is very difficult

having people discount how difficult it is seeing someone bully others no

matter what the reason and no matter how many problems the person

being bullied has that makes them a target. Any hidden agenda I might

have isn't really hidden at all. I was badly bullied as a child and as well

as a young adult. The reasons for me being bullied was my size and

that somehow I always seemed to say the wrong thing. Not trashing

people, just trying to fit in and not doing it very well. During the first

season Peeler rubbed me the wrong way. It was during the second

season that I began to see that Peeler is a damaged personality. He

has clearly been through a lot and he clearly struggles. For some reason

people seem to like to go for people like Peeler. Quick temper, calming

oneself down with booze, so common it begs to answer why billions are

not spent figuring out how to help such individuals. I loved Jackie. I

felt like I understood some of the behaviors I made excuses for until

the third season. I will not lie. I really wanted Jackie and Rebecca to

be together. The way Jackie was going to make Jesse pay for his

insistence that Rebecca just wanted more airtime. I made excuses for

Jackie intervening when it should have been just Rebecca and Jesse

working it all out. For me it was pretty obvious the person who would

do anything for more airtime was Jesse. This third season broke my

heart. I was stunned and felt more than just a little bit sick when

Jackie intruded on Erika and Rebecca's bootcamp. I felt ill when Jackie

brought Breana<sp> to the barbecue in the first episode third season

and sat at the dinner table making out with Breana. However, that

shock other than me feeling for Rebecca comes from the fact that I

personally would never make out at a table at a barbecue or anywhere

else where so many people were at my same table. It was tacky as

well as hurtful for Rebecca. I really like Rebecca in many ways. When

I was younger Rebecca was the kind of girl I wanted to be. Confident

and able to be able to get through difficult situations without

humiliating myself. Whether gay or straight, man or woman, there

are certain areas of behavior one needs to maintain. Jackie stepped

way over the line. I have no anti gay bias. Like most people I

struggled with my sexuality and actually never really figured it out.

Having back surgery can really derail the details so I simply decided

that if I meet someone and I click with that someone that whether

man or woman that is the relationship I will go after. It is better to not

rule anyone out. I don't know about anyone else on here but there

is no anti gay agenda with me. It has been a slap in the face for

anyone to come on here and make it clear that they believe that there

is no way that what we are doing MUST be anti-gay. How bigoted are

these remarks???? I had some very close friends that I grew up with

who were beaten up badly, lost jobs, all kinds of anti-gay actions. So

for me to be accused of anything Anti-Gay just gets me upset. I sat

at one friend's hospital bed after his beating. It was difficult to even

recognize him from the swollen features. All of these close friends

died within the last 20 years from AIDS. I lost so many people. It

still makes me cry to think of how horrible the struggle against AIDS

was. Anytime I'd write about it on the local BBS boards people

replied saying my friends deaths were what they deserved because

they were involved in acts against GOD. Most of these friends were

Christians and they went to church every week. Even if they went to

the bars on Saturday night. Speaking for myself, stop with the

accusations of my stand against Jackie Warner's behavior in this show

as being Anti-Gay. I don't deserve it, and I'd bet neither do the others

who are also standing against the bad behavior of Jackie Warner. It

is wrong and extremely hurtful. Why is it so difficult to believe that

having loved this show and Jackie Warner and then seeing her take that

love for her to a place where she believed that because we love her

we will understand Lisa and she trashing a client and then lying about

trashing the client. Firing Peeler because he wanted an apology from

her. I think that once you see the heartless behavior of someone who

you thought was an incredible human being you simply cannot go back

and love her the same way ever again. Whatever the reasons behind

my feelings it is not Anti-Gay and never would be. I have made a lot

of mistakes in my life but that area is not one of them.

Kari Ana

See, there in lies the problem in "our' community. If you don't fight for these things, you aren't a part of it and you are part of the problem. I could care less about gay marriage, however I have fought for domestic partnership. As long as our partners get the same benefits that married couples get, I really don't care what it is called.

You'll have to enlighten me on the equal rights one. I'm not aware of any rights that are taken away from me because I"m a lesbian.

Discrimination...it's everywhere in many forms. Against fat people, minorities, ugly people, it's a part of life. In fact...at a Pride event last year...the Log Cabin Republicans (which I support) were egged, taunted and eventually had to pack up and leave. Good tolerance there. Does that make it right? No. Maybe because I don't let my sexuality define me, it doesn't hinder me. I don't wear rainbows everywhere and I don't introduce my self as "hi I'm kiasmama and I'm a lesbian" It's something my friends learn about me when they get to know me. I do not hide it, nor do I flaunt it.



There is a difference between treating people badly and being generally disrespectful to people, and two consenting adults drinking and having sex. One inappropriate behavior does not equal another. Unless my employer is paying me for 24 hours of work, they have no say in what I do off the clock. I would say Renessa was irrisponsible more than inappropriate.

People hate gays due to stereotypes. Sex, drugs and more sex, oh and going after straight people. Well, this show sure didn't do a lot to change that. Jackie seems to want to hump anything that walks by, gay or straight. I hate that she was "marketed" as a lesbian. I wish she just would have been marketed as a woman. Sometimes when you belong to a certain group you have to hold yoursef to higher standards. As a state employee, I am held to higher standards than joe blow who works in the factory.

I worked for one summer on a AIDS fundraiser. I wll NEVER donate another dime to AIDS unless it is for local use. This wasn't in one locale, this was at several locations on the east coast. We visited bars, events and sold our stuff. At the bars, the guys would buy the stuff, say they support AIDS and then go bareback someone in the bathroom. I was appauled. This happened time and time again.

You are entitled to your opinions from your experiences, but just because someone doesn't shout "we're here, we're queer, we're everywhere" doens't mean they are less a member of the community.

Bah!! A week away from the boards and it looks like there is a sh|t-storm of negativity on each other. WOW!

Was sad to see Peeler's meltdown, but I have had my own nights like that, and felt like a heel after the fact. Other than that, watching he new episode the other day, in the end, left me bored. The show has jumped the shark. The show has run it's course, I think. Dont see it coming back for a new season.

Play nice you all. As individuals I guess we are all going to have to agree to disagree.

How funny is it that Lisa <NotAChefInMyKitchen> was able to use the

rules to not be sent home twice getting rid of Dale and Andrew? I

don't like Lisa but I disliked Dale and Andrew more. Especially Dale.

I think he believed he was this years Haung, I don't think so. I can

make rice also. Of course the bad rice was all Dale's fault because

he grabbed it from the top shelf?? How funny was that???

rotflmao.

Kari Ana

DrB sorry I missed your question. I had to work and I forgot to log off before stepping away.

To shorten a post in a "quote" dialogue box, hit reply, this will open the reply window. Now the post you are replying to is usually at top of the window, (I always place my response below their quote because when I read the posts, I prefer to read the statement/question first and the response second. I know some like to respond first and have the quote below.... guess it's a matter of preference).
Anyway, you can click anywhere within the original post, as long as it's previous to the bracketed quote [ quote ]. Then just highlight the text and hit delete, the original post is shortened and you are able to respond to what you feel is germane.
Hope that helped.

You have no idea how much your post effected me in such a very positive way. The entire post was beautiful.

I had mentioned earlier that I was straight and had an extremely wonderful friend who is gay. A group of us women go out one night a week and we have fun, share experiences, have very lively and heated debates about things, and just enjoy the company of women. No matter what our views are/were, it was never, ever, said our feelings were based on biases against others.

I came here though because of my feelings over Jackie and how very demoralized I was over seeing someone I had admired be so callous, disrespectful and demeaning to another woman; or anyone for that matter. I had no hidden agenda of any kind. Wasn't even an inkling in my thoughts. Then to see so much rhetoric that if we were so against Jackie, we had to have hidden agendas and/or be bigots. I was totally freaked.

I was scared to death to ask my friend if this was the norm. Was she, and/or her friends thinking things like this behind my back... I was so emotionally upset. I had never thought of any of my friends in terms of their sexualty, but in terms of who there were as a person, their beliefs, how they treated others, their honesty and strength.

Then I read your post here and you gave me another view .. so you know what? Because of you, I called my friend and told her everything. Needless to say, she broke up laughing hysterically at me and not only reiterated what you said, but emphatically expressed she loved your post too.

I'm also angry at how much potential damage these hateful posts might cause in others. I'm angry at Jackie, and I'll scream it from the roof tops if I have to. She needs to be held accountable for her actions and she needs to step up and admit her contribution to this entire episode with Jamie.

Kiasmama...I need to know where you got that picture you have next to your name. I want to blow it up and put it on my ceiling. GREAT picture.

Go back and read my response last night to Dacia and true reality. Apparently, Dacia has decided I am not gay because I knew too much about the GLT issues and therefore must be a "poser". Alex is going to so disappointed when she gets back from her trip to find out I'm not really gay after 20 years together. Everyone expresses themselves differently. If you want to shout from the roof tops, great. If you want to just live you life and be who you are where ever you are, great. Just be real.

Thank you, Liam. By the way, I'm not gay anymore.

KisaB, I can't play kickball (torn ligament in my ankle).
But will gladly sit on the sidelines and cheer everybody on.
I don't agree with everything my "real world" friends and contacts think either
but I will defend their right to think it.
And I can bring the Kool-Aid (but it may be disguised as bottles of Propel).

Reposted B)

Good for you! I'm not finding it easy being "homosexual", but I intend to keep practicing

actually much has been said, but a lot has been taken down probably due to lawyers advice. doens't mean they don't give a hoot. She didn't defend brian, but she did comment on his firing.



The staff at The Gym is MUCH more knowledgable about nutrition and fitness. I've commented on that way back in the beginning. Much more repudable place than SSS, imo.

People can have more that one area of interest. Jackie has a gym and a clothing/fashion line. I have no idea what brian does, nor do I care, but people can have two jobs.



Getting drunk and acting the fool, might be considered a mistake...the first time. If you continually do it...then it's a character issue. Jackie has continually made comments about her clients. Mean and vendictive things. That's simply not cool and I think ventures past the "mistake" bar. Frankly I had no idea who jackie warner was before Workout, so what does that mean? I dont' get your point. For people who are really in the fitness industry, jamie eason is a familiar face.



Have you ever read those waivers people sign? If you pretty much sneeze the wrong way the parent company will sue you. VERY few reality show people are in litigation. Why do you think that is? Because they are all super happy? No,because they waive many of their rights to be on the show.



Since people are into quotes here...I'll paraphrase from Jurassic Park. "Just because you could have, doesn't mean you should have" I can say you are a fat ugly lesbian [expletive deleted] and no one can tell me otherwise. But does that make it right? Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. As a business owner (one who claims to be sympathetic to fat people, well she takes their money) there are certain comments you shouldn't make in public, let alone on camera. I find it scarey that you can't seperate the two things.


How do you know this?



Who ever posted that he is not accountable for anything? You are grabbing here. If anyone has shown a lack of accountability, it's jackie.




There is another problem. A "few stupid words" Hmm, what if those words were derogitory to race, or sexual preferance? Would they just be a few stupid words that made a bad joke? I'll call a random person walking down the street the N word. So what...I dont' know him, I have no reason to respect anything about him. Might be a pedophile for all I know. Can you not see the flaws with that line of thinking in a civilized society?




Actually the law decides what is legal and illegal. The moral majority decides appropriateness. For example, infanticide is perfectly fine in some cultures, but not ours. It's ILLEGAL, not inappropriate. Or...Honor Killings if you will. See the difference.



You probably need to start doing more research and start thinking for yourself rather than believing all the rhetoric that is being spewed to you from the people you are working with (whatever gay rights group) Ad hominens and red herrings are paramount to arguments when those arguments lack substance. You are making it nearly impossible to take anything you say seriously because you revert to these tactics. Take a debate course, a logic course, or hang out with people who use facts instead of tactics to make their arguments. You are spouting some real nonsense.

Thank you, thank you, thank you, Kiasmama!!! Well said! (sound of applause and crowd cheering)

thank you, that's very nice :-) Human dynamics are very interesting...especially when there is anonymitty (I know I messed up that spelling..lol) involved. You made me smile.

never mind.....

It is one of the most.....dare I say....HOT pictures I have ever seen in my life. It's my facebook bumpersticker I actually don't remember where I found it on the net. If I do come across any bookmarks that have it...I will certainly pass it along. I agree...I would LOVE to have that pic hanging on my wall...or ceiling....or car....

I know what you mean. Alex woke me up this morning before her flight for a "quickie". She will be so disappointed when she gets home to find out that for 20 years I have really been working for the "under ground" trying to get our relationship nullified. Guess that will be our last romp in the hay. At least it was a good one.

The best, most erotic kiss ever in cinematography history is between Jenniffer Beals and Lauren Hollaman in season 1 of the L Word. OH MY GOD!!!!! Makes me wet thinking about it. Unbelievable!!! (Can you say stuff like that on here?)

DrB, did you see my post about peglam?
OOPS! Should save this for later

Where is it? I think I did but now I can't find it. Repost it here for me or send me the page number. Why do they tend to come out late at night? Dacia is on my sh*t list. I will be on here all day and night til she comes back.

If you guys could humor me for a moment, I wrote the above prior to watching this week's episode (see time stamp) (to view the original post click arrow next to time stamp). After viewing Jackie's improved portrayal, (which was much closer in tone to seasons 1 & 2) I started to believe that maybe jackie had been given a "negative edit".
I still continued to express my belief that Jackie should make a statement to the fans of Work Out- not necessarily an apology (that would be up to her if she sincerely felt culpable). But I was backing off from my cancel/boycott mentality (which stemmed from being outraged at the offensive behavior shown on Work Out). I was beginning to feel I had overreacted.

But with all of the name calling and "blame placing", I decided to read all of my old posts to be sure of what I actually had posted and how my point of view may be perceived.

And I must say, the pro-Jackie camp has been very cruel and nasty on this board to many posters who did not deserve to be treated so disrespectfully, just for simply stating an opinion.
I encourage everyone else to take a look at all of the posters who never returned to these boards after being "taken to task" by these thugs.

If these individuals have anything at all to do with the show, the gym or JW herself, they should be ashamed. My anger is back to it's original sense of resolve. So thank you pro-Jackie posters for pissing me off, I will try to return the favor.

Where is our Booglie? I have a reception to plan.

Girl, you are a major troll warrioress, what ya being wimpy over a little (OK, big!) ole kitty cat for?

NiCi...I wrote this earlier today. The cat is evil and only acts out when Alex is gone. He stalks me in my own home. We have a German Shepherd ,Millicent, and she won't come in the house. This AM Alex left for a trip to London (flight attendant) and woke me before she left for...well you know( ). Anyway, the cat literally sat on the chair next to the bed, never moved during our... you know. As soon as she went to the shower, damn cat jumped on my head. One day the cat will "accidentally" get out...oh what a day of rejoicing that will be... Did I mention that cat is the size of a small goat?

Liam, have I told you lately that I love you?

No wonder you want to cook Booglie's goatlets, they remind you of that stoopid cat, don't they? Come on now, fess up!

OK, I have one word for you.... catnip!
Drug that big ole kitty out of its big nasty ole goard!
Get enough to last the entire time Alex is gone...
A happy, drugged out kitty will not attack you (as long as it is kept happily high) and if all else fails you can lay a trail of it leading out the door!
Problem solved!!!!:)

I can't wait until Pee joins us.... I think I have much more than a "loaded banana"... where is my stoopid monkeeey emoticon? ( )

Ok, now that we are all here, I would like to call this meeting to order. First order of business: (a)Dacia, true, peglam, jack123, Nama(?)...I am ready, Liam is ready. How about the rest of you? (b)Name calling...we will not stoop to their ignorant rants but we all know what is true. ©Gay or not be gay...whatever. (d)Dates for the wedding and the menu for the reception. I guess I am paying for it because Liam and JC didn't leave me last night when Dacia and TR showed up.

Anything else? I now call this meeting to order...

Where is the post?

I was thinking you should just give it a bath.... I bathed our family cat when I was a little kid and that thing avoided me for the rest of it's life! Of course, once I saw that big fluffy kitty looking all skinny and sad, I did point and laugh! (did I mention I was a kid?). I thought it was the ugliest critter I had ever seen! (no offense to anyone who likes wet pussies, just not to my individual liking- I'm more of a rooster man myself).

Thought I'd save it until later......

I am here. You guys (generic term) Rock. Need I say more?

LOL!!!LOL!!!! That is the funniest thing I've heard all day. !!! I might like the cat if I could see it in the light of wetness and all...hmmm. Where do I get catnip?

You don't have to clarify yourself when you say "guys". It's the same as me saying "ya'll". Just depends on what you grew up with saying.

Any pet supply store should have it, ask the salesperson how to use it - no lie, it is totally like drugs to them (but does not harm them at all) - they love it! That beast will be your friend for life (of course it will be the junkie and you will be it's supplier, but you don't mind that relationship as long as it does not attack you, right?!)

Thanks, some peeps on this board get a little "tetchy" 'bout that kind of stuff, so just want to make sure I'm not stepping on toes needlessly! (I'm getting accused of so much, that I don't want to add any more to it, isn't that sad?!)

Well, Dears, my neighbors just called and offered to feed me, so gotta run and eat, but will be back as soon as I can! Take care!

Just come on over here and you can eat steak at my house. But bring the catnip when you come. Damn cat is lurking as I type...I don't know where he is but he will appear momentarily. Maybe I should rename him pedartrujanam...I shall ponder this for awhile.

Ok...sounds like a plan. Alex called and I had to tell her I wasn't gay anymore. At first she kind of laughed then I could tell she was pretty pissed. She didn't think it was funny. She was sitting with me last night when I wrote my post to Dacia and to true reality and she is NOT happy. She will be watching from the shadows, I bet.

Sorry for not responding,
I've been stuffing tranquilizers into bananas all day in preparation for tonight's party. (jeesh, my thumbs are killing me...)

I get hung up for awhile and nothing changes. Dacia is posting long posts about people not being real gay people. The wedding plans seem to be continuing. Other people are still name calling, and are very very angry.

Oh I would tell someone where I got my nick, which is a joke, if they were not talking about BBQ-ing the triplets.

It's been quiet tonight.... was it something I said???..... LOL
Guess my "advice" hit home last night.

NO. I didnt say "how dare anyone question Peeler" I say its not about Peeler. Its about Jackies behaviour. Theres a huge difference there. You are not paying attention to these posts and just making things up to support yourself.




If you really read these threads and posts since the episode aired you'd see the "gay" word was never thrown around or used against Jackie. The only ones who brought it up first were the ones trying to use it as "the reason we hate Jackie" which isnt true and not that diffulct to understand unless you are bias and want perpetuate that propaganda. The posts are on these boards and they are all time stamped showing this.

There was no hidden agenda, thats fabricated by people like you. The very people who were fans of this show one day and disgusted with it the next were all well aware of Jackies orientaion from the begining and didnt have a problem with it. That episode wassnt that "gay." There were plenty of same sex make out scenes in other episodes and they didnt evoke any rage because no one was offended by it. They were offended by Jackies BEHAVIOUR. Get that? BEHAVIOUR. NOT THAT SHE WAS A LESBIAN. Its not that hard to see if you open your eyes and your mind. Even the 700 club doesnt monitor every gay related tv show to pick parts out and vilanize homosexuality. You dacia and true need to get some therapy to sort whatever issues in your lives make you see these conspiracies or just get glasses or share a brain that works. You are calling homosexuals homophobic and dont see how ridiculous you look doing it.





NO. I never mentioned that event. You are creating more things in your head there.

You really are confused and should start paying more attention if you want to go quoting and putting words in peoples mouths.

I still find it interesting how you gloss over Nama's first post about how she talks like an "insider" and blasts Peeler's friendship with Doug and downplays it as if Doug didnt really like him, her opinion on behalf of a deceased person. Thats someones friend, no matter how another person percieved their friendship there were feelings there. Saying something like that is just as wrong as Jackies behaviour on the show. But you cant see that either. Thats what you are siding with. Its disgusting.

You really held your own. I am still shocked at the viciousness of those posts. I can't help but wonder if some of the viciousness is due to fear of lost income from investments.

(in my best sideshow barker voice)- We have a winner! Winnah, winnah, chicken dinnah!