KariAna

I have read both Cher and Chastities Books and can see them from

where I am sitting. The title of the book i am referencing is "The First

Time" By Cher.

Dude...that is SOOOO gay but funny as hell! If Dacia reads that she will know for sure that you are gay. Have fun...if you get a chance, tell Cher I said hello. I'll be at the golf tournament all weekend. Let me know when to make my reservations to come to PS. We'll leave the cat at home.

Don't do that! They would absolutley love it and it would give them more

reason to trash us and brag that they have a lesbian woman that

supports their network...

Write the Advocate and contact GLAAD.

I understand what your saying but I disagree. I lost way too many

friends who grew up believing all STDs can be cured. NO ONE DESERVES

TO BE INFLICTED WITH HIV OR AIDS NO MATTER WHAT THEIR

BEHAVIOR. Personal responsibility is one thing, the cost of this mistake

is their life. I think that is enough punishment for being careless.

Kari Ana

I'm just glad the telephone psychic lines aren't spreading hate and bigotry and pushing a Conservative Republican agenda.

They're not are they are.... Should we call Dionne Warwick and her psychic friends? Naw, she has always been a friend of the gays.

Even if they were I most certainly wouldn't call them once I knew of such an insidious connection.

But I know what you mean Kari Ana, and I totally agree. Some will now come to Jackie's defense regarding this issue, which for me is almost indefensible.

I'm just glad I haven't made a "Nazi collaborator" comment yet (but I did hear they paid really well.... in gold teeth and such).

I know that there is a great deal of differing opinions among the gay and lesbian community. I don't have a litmus test for anyone saying they are gay.

Still having seen children born with drug addiction, hiv, or birth defects, having seen people in Africa afraid to go to hell because the leader of their religion said they would if they use a condom, and HIV going amuck, I have no idea how someone could say some of the things I have read on this board. Compassion, love and understanding is something we should practice, more than judgement.
I had to have five, two hour surgeries in four days, and they had to keep me awake so I could assist them inserting the tubes through my body. It is a miracle I did not get HIV, and my behavior had nothing to do with if I got it or not.
I am one of those people who believe a child having their first sexual experience, and gets HIV from that experience, don't deserves it. I don't see a girl having sex for the first time and gets pregnant, deserves it. There are lots of people having unsafe sex all the time, the ones who do not get it(HIV, STD's, pregnancy), are no more innocent nor guilty then the ones who get it.

When she said "start calling"..... she mean't start referring to Fox News as Fox News Entertainment

Not calling as on the phone, my little militant chucklehead

Kari Ana...I, too, thought it extremely weird that the two accidents happened so close to each other. My family still refers to Alex as my roommate when they introduce us to people. We just laugh. Sometimes I get frustrated and plant a big ol' kiss on Alex and my mother about has a heart attack. Oh well...Did you get the rain ya'll needed? I'll be in later tonight but I have the Colonial Golf tournament all weekend so I'll pop in later.

Sorry MY BAD... BAD jc, BAD jc....

So you can talk about all this other personal crap for hundreds of pages and now you want me to respond via PM because this is a Workout board? That's rich. Did you tell KisaB if she had an issue with me (she used my name I didn't use hers) to do it via PM? You certainly didn't mind my other posts calling out people you didn't like so why now? Lol..Puleezz

I dont' need a history lesson on AIDs, I"m very familiar with it. I took part in the fundraiser (thousands of my own dollars) becasue I cared about the children who contracted AIDS from their parents. Parents who made some shitty choices. AIDS is one of the most preventable diseases there is. What is the percentage that get it thru actions other than unprotected sex? Why is there so much AIDS in Africa? I'm quite certain we send millions of condoms there....they don't use them due to religious objection. So, we are supposed to feel sorry for them?

the people who were affected when no one knew better are likely all passed on. For the last 15-20 years we have known the causes of AIDS. Great, the number is going down. Well, it should be dwidling by now. Why isn't it? Because people make bad decisions. I will give my compassion to a child that contracted an addiction or disease thru no fault of his own. Not an adult that contracted a disease due to poor decision making capibility.

I'm speaking of gay bars that I was in and things that I witnessed. I dont' think a behavior going on in 30+ gay bars is an anomile. Or maybe we just picked the wrong ones. What are the odds?

Maybe the same thing goes on in straight bars...I have no idea, I don't go to them. Nor do I go to gay bars except for a special occassion.

Put the Cat in the shower, close the door and leave the water dripping. Kitty torcher....

I do not support Fox News. I figure if more people know they are

licensed as Entertainment any credibility they have with people may

just disappear. I don't even have Fox News on my favorites on my

satillite dish. I have always boycotted Fox News because they are

nothing more than Jerry Springer disguised as News. What a joke.

When they have been sued the judges always summary judgment for

FOX news because they are not licensed as a News Outlet. Fox News

has no more credibility than a telephone pyschic. I am not against

psychics. It is the telephone psychic lines that I am speaking about.

Kari Ana

Kia is actually my parrot :-) You know how we gays call pets our kids...




having unprotected sex with someone is usually not an accident. I dont' think a car accident is an accurate analogy because the death or result of the accident was thru no fault of thier own. With AIDS, most people contracted it thru a fault of thier own. Again, AIDS is one disease that you can virtually control whether or not you contract it. There aren't very many diseases you can say that about. If I don't smoke, I still might get lung cancer. If I dont' have unprotected sex, I will probably win the powerball lottery before I get AIDS. That's my point.




Yes, sometimes bad things happen to good people. But, if good people make bad decisions that lead to that bad thing, it takes a bit away for me. Look, I don't go into an addictions clinic blaming the addicts for being addicts. Most of them are very good people, with warm hearts that got caught up in a bad place. I have compassion for them, however I also expect them to accept personal responsibilty for the situation they are in. If they don't, then they get less compassion from me. that's just the way I am. Why should I waste emotional energy on someone that is not willing to care for themselves? Why should I care?

No offense at all. I like having debate. If we all thought the same, the world would be a boring place.



The nights I spent in those bars were some of the most eye opening, or I guess closing, time of my life. I never expected that and I still can't beleive it. We visited several high profile clubs in the DC area, Philly, Baltimore, connecticut and NY. We also went to some not so nice clubs. They were all virtually the same which stunned me! I have several gay male friends, both single and in relationships who don't partake in that kind of behavior. I don't know what it was about those bars, but it changed my opinion for ever.

But if there behavior were different, then might not be in that situation. I get that everyone deserves a second chance and all that jazz. But if you are going to take chances and yes, I think having unprotected sex is a chance, then you have to be ready to accept those consequences. Whether the consequence is an STD or a pregnancy.

We face risks in life everyday just by getting out of bed. Sex is one area that I think we have an aweful lot of control over. We don't have to do it to survive. Especially with all the information (not to mention free testing) that is available today. There is really no excuse for it.

can you say why it's a miracle you didn't get HIV? I'm just not sure what you are saying is all. If you don't want, that's fine. I would also add, those days are long gone getting HIV via the blood supply. Nor do I think a lot of children get it having their first sexual experience. If people have unsafe sex, then they make their bed. I mean I don't stand on a street corner and shout "good for you, you immoral puke" really I don't. But I"m not going to spend a lot of time feeling compassion for someone who makes bad decisions. Why should I? I'm not talking about ONE bad decision. I'm talking about several...which to me..means a character flaw. Thems the breaks.

And just for the record...I feel the same way about IV drug users and straight people that contract the HIV virus via their choices. I have several tattoos and I am fully aware that there is a risk. Truth be told I worry much more about Hep C than HIV in those situations, but my point is, I make a choice and I have to live with the consequences.

I am having an extremely difficult time with what your saying. When

one of my best friends died of AIDS my heart broke. He was in a

relationship. They didn't cheat on each other ever. What happened

was that the guy relapsed into IV drug use and my friend had no idea

because the guy had been clean for a very long time. When he

discovered the drugs he through out the love of his life and went to be

tested immediately. First test negative. Second test positive. He died

eight years later because he took good care of himself. Yes many

drugs for AIDS now works great UNLESS you have one of those

aggressive strains. I knew this other guy who caught it because his

longtime partner cheated and he didn't know it until it was too late.

He died within three years and that was last year. He did everything

he was supposed to. The strain was so agressive he had no chance. I

really think that you are either yanking people's chain or else you truly

don't understand human nature. How many straight women and mean

have caught AIDS from their spouses because the spouse cheated?

Woman are more vulnerable than men with straight sex at least the

doctors say so. To believe someone deserves AIDS or HIV puts one

into the same league as those Right Wing Jerks who can't wait to tell

a grieving family that their loved one died because he/she was bad

person. I am stunned that anyone would believe what you have said.

Kari Ana

Once again, did I tell you I LOOOOVE you!!!

Did I tell you, " I LOOOOVE YOU" !!!

Okay, you both did. I love you guys too. I suppose I should stop

hiding my soapbox since I keep standing on top of it all the time.

Kari Ana

Now can we get back to Workout or stupid HARMLESS dialog????

Hey JC don't try to jump on my bandwagon, Kari Ana is all mine!

Big hugs Kari Ana!

And JC don't be bitter, LuvYa! Mean It!

My surgeries were back in 1997. Things were not quite as sure back then about the blood supply. Every surgery when blood was needed only added to risk of getting something from the blood.

Kari Ana,
Thank you for stipulating that your commentary has to do with "telephone psychic lines." (talking about full-disclosure) I am a professional Psychic-Medium/Tarologist, have been for 27 years.
Just offering, as a professional in the field, I refer to the psychic hotlines as "Psychic Sweat-shops". The Fee gouges the clients ($3.99 or more per minute) the "psychics" don't get a fair cut of that (in my experience, I worked for one of the companies for one month) . Part of the phone caller's time is taken up hawking the services of the network, repeating the phone number and the extension. I found it degrading to work under such conditions and found it did not honor the clients.
I do readings by phone and on rare-occations online, and in my home.
Which leads to an odd tie-in here with the original topic, Jackie Warner's treatment of her clients and her trainers. People who come have a reading are vulnerable and looking for assistance. It is incumbant upon me, as the practitioner, to treat each client with honor and integrity. I think clients that go to a gym deserve no less.
I don't discuss my client's failings with my family or friends or other psychics. In my view, Jackie Warner has abused more than one sacred trust.
If she had represented herself in another way, perhaps my expectations would have been less.

Gypsy in FL

OK, I know JC and I have posted our outrage regarding FOX News and Jackie Warner's participation with that company.
And many of you may think we are overreacting,
but I encourage you to go to http://www.foxnews.com/index.html
and do your own research and form your own opinion.

I searched for articles about gays and lesbians using certain words:
Gay, Lesbian... even "Homosexual" (since that seems to be a favorite term to refer to us among the Religious Right).
I really didn't find anything too insidious.....
Most articles seemed slightly biased.... but I can accept (and almost expect)
that from a conservative right wing establishment.

But here is the thing about Search Engines, it is really all about Key Words....
try: Homosexual Agenda

Now read some of the articles..... I am fuming mad at what is reported on this site....

The poor innocent State Representative (a Preacher's Wife even)
who is getting "Death Threats" for having an opinion about Gays.......
Look at how they describe Ellen Degeneres in this article....
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,338271,00.html

Or this article about Gov. Rick Perry who is promoting his book "On My Honor: Why the American Values of the Boy Scouts Are Worth Fighting For"...
http://www.foxnews.com/wires/2008Feb20/0,4...utsBook,00.html

These are just a few examples on the site.... I encourage everyone to go and decide for themselves.... excuse me, I need to go throw up now!

Kiasmama, Kiasmama, Kiasmama...I'm taking a break from the heat and I have to respond. Still love the picture next to your name but I'm curious. Did you grow up in a evangelical, fundamentalist church? I did. I can remember as a young teenager screaming on the inside because of the teachings about God and His love and yet hearing also about too bad, you got what you deserved. I am reminded of the story of the woman caught in adultery (John 8). She represents everyone of us. Caught in the act. Dragged through the streets. Naked. Terrified. Probably scrapped and bruised. The religious leaders of the times were WAY above what she had done. So they throw her at the feet of Jesus and they tell him everything they have found her doing. Jesus looked at them and bent down and began to write in the dirt. If you want to piss off pious, self righteous people, ignore them. They said she should be stoned because that is what the law required of someone caught in adultery. They asked him what he thinks they should do. He stands up, wipes his hands off and says, "Those of you without 'this' sin, you get to cast the first stone." Then he bends back down and begins to write again. One by one, beginning with the oldest ones, they dropped there rocks and left. We are then left with the two most important characters of the story. Jesus and the woman. He is important because he is who he says he is and she in important because she represents each and everyone of us. Dirty, scared, naked and face down in the dirt at the feet of Jesus. He reaches down and lifts her face, takes his thumb and wipes the tears from her face. He turns and says, "Give her your coat, James." and he covers her. Then he asks, "Who condemns you? Who?"
She looks around and sees no one. As she looks into his eyes, she says, "No on Lord." And Jesus says to her, "Neither do I condemn you." That's called grace. I hope somewhere in your heart you realize that to not share compassion with someone is being just like the religious bigots of that day and the fundamentalist religious sector of today. This post will probably get deleted but I hope it makes a point before it does. We all have a story and I am thankful that when my story took some really bad turns, I had those around me who didn't judge me nor condemn me but loved me and covered my "nakedness" with their coat of kindness and wiped the tears of my soul with their compassionate heart and offered me a hand to get me back on my feet. I hope somewhere you have experienced that grace because it requires that we give that same grace to others.

Thus ended the lesson...

The following posts have been edited (shortened) due to content (BS) and length (interminable). If you wish to view these tirades in their entirety click the arrow next to the time stamp.

Exhibit A: On May 18th Jack123 says:


Exhibit B: On May 20th Nama says:


Exhibit C: Exhibit A + Exhibit B = HA HA!

Your friend and ardent admirer (I hang on your every word!), Clyiam

If you sprinkle it in some Jack Daniels, I'm sure it works just fine! Don't let this ruin your weekend with Cher JC, it will all still be here when you get back!

Never does answer questions, just spews hate and misinformation, makes baseless accusations and calls names. but keep asking questions. The more it does not answer, the more it shows it's stripes!

Is that stirred, shacken, over ice or just straight up??? Oh and please make it a double....

FG!
I am so very, very glad to see you! I did not see you yesterday and got a little worried... we have had a couple of people go missing lately, and I thought you might have joined them! So very glad I was wrong!

Did the beast attack you last night?
Did you catnip it?
Did you bath it?
Did you end up in the ER?
Spill it, Girl, enquiring minds want to know...Now!

Awww, his first endearment to his betrothed!
Pssst! Quick, somebody write it down in the wedding book! "My.Little.Militant.Chucklehead."

I will miss you all while I'm gone. I will ask Cher to become a member of our group....

Any which way you like it (and as much as you like) JC - and I don't say that to just anyone!

OUTSTANDING POST!!!!!! thank, you, DrB...Great job.

We will miss you too, and will take good care of Liam (although I am not sure we can keep all of the cabanna boys out of his room - but we will try!)! If Cher does not want to become a member of our group, tell her the Cher barbie on the top of the christmas tree story. If that does not work just kidnap her and bring her home anyway!

Girl,,,, Cher Barbie is going with! She will have a great view on top of the dash of car on the way and fourth row seats at the show... I am not fn Kidding, this will be her (Cher Barbie) third show. I would never hear the end of it If I didn't take her.... One from each of us.....

My back surgeries were in 93 and 95. Both times I had to give my

own blood ahead of time for my surgeries. That way no problems.

Kari Ana

I am psychic also. I made sure I was absolutely clear with that. I

sure believe in what happens through me. Maybe we can talk

sometime. I think you probably are aware that we are on the verge

of something huge right now.

Kari Ana

Liam, Darlin, I think your biggest competition is gonna be from that Cher barbie doll! I betcha he wants to bring her on the honeymoon! Ha! Your biggest competition from a GIRL after all!!!!

Maybe that is were Farmgirl is on an Olivia cruise with the Mrs???

You were so lucky. I didn't have the warning though.
I had to have another surgery 6 months later to try to repair the leg damage as best they could(only one). The good news is both times, I was at the best hospital in the South, one of the best on the East coast.

When are you seeing Cher???????

I adore her. Always have, when the crazy tv show was on, I was always glued to the show. I have no idea why my father watched it. He watched All in the Family and never got they were making fun of Archie.

Monday at 7:30 in Las Vegas... This will be my 4th time... Best show I have ever seen...

Just remember when she is singing Turn Back Time, that I am right beside you, big smile on my face, sipping my virgin margarita.

Just thought of a good question.

Which show, person, singer would you go see, if you could?

I want to see Wicked, and then Avenue Q.

"Andre? Where's Andre..... what happened to Andre?"- Tim Gunn Project Runway

CLICK THE ARROW IN THE DIALOGUE WINDOW ABOVE TO READ SOMETHING INTERESTING.... C'mon click it you know you want to....

For anyone new to these boards....
I understand it would be difficult (if not down right impossible) to read through all of these posts.
There are some really wonderful posts throughout this board (and I don't want to lessen there importance), but to get a quick snapshot of what we posters/protesters
(Prosters?) have been going through.....I would recommend starting in the mid 70s, maybe page 74.

Hopefully you will see how we have been attacked by "The Pro-Jackie Camp" who have nothing whatsoever to do with Sky Sport and Spa- yet have inside, intimate knowledge of....

I realize we can get side tracked now and then... if anything you might find a laugh or two from some of our less than "professional behavior"- but in our defense it's a posting board on Bravo's site to talk about TV, so hopefully you won't judge us too hashly....
I also encourage everyone and anyone reading these boards (either Pro or Against) to join the discussion.

I would guess there aren't that many people that contract the disease thru no fault of their own. I actually know someone who contracted HIV from her husband. He never told her he had it, and he infected her. I am in no way saying she deserved it, nor do I think I said that. I'm sorry some people have that perception.

That fact that innocents get it, does not counter that the great majority get HIV thru bad decisions. That's all I'm saying. I'm not implying it's God's way to take care of the immoral among us.

No I didn't, but my views are conservative, which may explain a lot :-) (and yes I think the big oil companies should be able to make whatever profit they can make) I was actually quite liberal at one time, but my views changed as I got older.

I'm really not trying to sound holier than thou. I have compassion for people and it is not weighted on whether or not they have my values and beliefs. It's not that I think less of people who have AIDS via behavior, it's just that I don't have as much compassion for them. It doesn't mean I'm going to spit in their water, or take lesser care of them if I have to, it's just that I don't have the same compassion for them internally.

I worked as a prison guard for several years. I was fair and very respectful to all the prisoners. I treated child molesters and DUI cons the same way. Does that mean I harbored the same compassion for them? No it does not. I treated them the same because it's the right thing to do. How I feel about them internally is another story however.