That really bothered me also. Even if we don't agree with eachother there's no reason for attacking some one. I can' t believe the google search thing. That was way over the top.

Funny little observation from yesterday when true was on last night! I was lurking on other sites and signed into this one. Ms. Warner was also signed in on her My Space Page... Hummmmm
If you look at true's post it was about Me and Dr.B, Makes you feel kind of important in thier small little world .

Hey..has anyone been watching the mcGreevey divorce trial on Tru TV? Whew....talk about nasty...I guess his lawyers are trying to prove that the wife knew he was gay and this was a political marriage to promote both of their interests. Yikes...the dirt!

Just saw that Angelina Jolie gave birth to her twins this am in France. OMG am I gonna take a beatin' later for chit chatting and being off topic.

JC...I am honored to be associated with such a remarkable man. Now go call Booglie and Liam and wake them up and tell them how important we are. I'll call NiCi...

Hey has anyone looked at the picture of the trainers for the workout video. I think Jesse is trying to either be enveloped by Jackie or he's trying to stick his butt out farther than it can go or he has boobs he is trying to show. I don't know which but laughed really hard when I saw it. (Me laughing really hard, easing off and left with a smile!)

I thought they weren't due until August or something? Are they ok? Boys/girls/what?

Yeah me too. No other info available yet.

The picture I am talking about is the one with the caption "Which trainer are you?". Of course there is Rebecca who looks like she is joined at the hip with Jackie. WOW!!! I don't remember Agostina's ab's looking so hot!! OMG!!!!

Just saw it...looks kinda like he has gas.

I just want to state once more that I have taken a neutral position on this thread.
I went back and read the boards (not all of the messages but enough to see what the people who PMed me were talking about) and I think I have an idea of the intentions of both sides in this kerfluffle.

I understand the people who feel they are here to protest the show and I think of them like picketers who discuss personal issues and make friendships while walking the picket lines.

And I understand the people who think it's just a TV show and that people should just stop watching... I think (and I am trying to be neutral so don't attack me) the Proshow side loses some ground when some of them tell others they don't have the right to their personal opinions.

I have gotten caught up in the negativity on these boards as well. I have also gotten caught up in the positivity. We are social creatures, human beings are susceptible to external influences (just ask any marketing student).
I tend to not respond if someone posts something negative about me (which really hasn't happened here- I acted a fool, and was respectfully asked to not do it here).

For those with differing opinions these boards are like any other tool or machine created by humans they are neither good nor bad in nature but can become so in how they are used.

I have stated some proshow points of view and not been screamed at... But even if I had, I would most likely just ignore that gnat because I am here for so many varied reasons (all personal) and feel no need to defend myself to an anonymous voice online who means nothing to me.

Sorry for taking up so much time... I just think the battles here get a little out of control and if someone says something you disagree with just let them say it. I just try to continue on with my own reasons for being here and it seems to work for me.

This is just some advice I gained after posting on numerous boards and sites for far longer than I want to admit.

But advice is like anything else you are given, you are the one who decides whether or not to accept it. I'm not responsible if you don't see the value of it just because it is free.

It's not an obsession, it's a cause and I have turned it off.

I do feel bad for Jesse because he was the fat, bad one last season. Talked about Doug, overweight for a trainer...so on and so on. Now, he seems to be trying to figure out how to be just who he is but Jackie will use him until she doesn't need him anymore and then she will push him aside and discard him just like she does everyone else.

Speak for yourself! I find Jacks posts to be interesting and well thought out.

Please read the first two words of my post.

Gracie...do you think he is well thought out when he resorts to degrading others and calling someone names because he doesn't like what they say or stand for? Do you think he is well thought out when he questions my life and my profession? I am offended but more I am saddened that he hides and doesn't answer questions directly but resorts to junior high antics to make his point. I appreciate his point of view, I don't agree with it but he is welcome to it. I have called him a name once and I apologized but yet he still feels the need to belittle and mock me and so many others here who he feels like in some way might be taking something from him. I have yet to fugure out what he is so angry about. Maybe you can help me see what I am missing.

Right. I never defended Jackie. I only said I like her. Not fighting that. but, its been said many many times by the same people. It aint changing, is all I am saying. She isn't going to apologize anytime soon, that is what I am saying here.

I agree.



That's a bit stalkerish.

Hey Clara

I have to run! but wanted to say "Hello". I say you on Step up Board last night! I thought there was going to be a Cat Fight... Snobby

Jack123 has been making some mighty nasty attacks in general across the boards...really. I've noticed that it seems to be in the way an angry youngster will stomp his feet and yell when told to go to his room (or sit down and quietly eat a cookie while the adults have a conversation). In my most humble opinion, it may be best to not argue with him once he has been politely told to please not attack others in the discussion. I've seen this behavior before on the message boards. I'm honestly hoping it is just kids sneaking onto the computer after they've been told to go to bed by their parents. I'd hate to think there are actual adults in here (or the other boards) who believe the best way to get their point across to a group of individuals is by threatening, belittleing, ranting, fighting for the sake of a fight - not a cause. Now, that would be depressing - if his only means of friendship or sense of belonging in a group is to cause friction so he can get noticed. If that's the case, I'll try to be a lot nicer to him due to is disability and hope he is seeking out medical help for his affliction...poor guy...

Gotta agrre with ya on the point of someone taking the stalking-type tactic of investigating someone...kinda sick.

And also agreing with the point about we're not always going to agree with everyone, but if we respect each others' right to have said opinion or view and have the chance to speak it-discuss it, we have a HUGE chance to displell misconceptions about folks in general.

Sorry I missed you guys last night...had a bunch of stuff to do at home.

Actually, no, we are not. this is what I mean. So, if there are other opinions, they are either one of the same person, or they are cast members. You are doing it again, this is why Jack is callling some of you harpies. you cry about being attacked, yet you do the same thing. I have not attacked, and i find I am constantly defending myself. It is just outright vicious on your part. Reading back, I see that this is a pattern. If one is not a zealot, one will be smeared, slowly but surely. I truly believe that some of you actually have more than one name. Liam, for one. He is either on here as himself, or with that other new name, or as Larceny or just viewing anonymously. He has 3 of the same names on one ISP address. So, don't go and say that about those that don't agree with you. DRB is one of he most hateful people here..unless you agree with her. JC is another hateful person. VERY hateful. UNLESS you are in the hate jackie camp. Well, I am very sorry, but it is very unfair to those that come on here to discuss the show. That is why you have who you call "haters". Because they just get so beat up, finally, they stand up and take their ground. YOU are actually going to excuse someone that says gay people DESERVE AIDS just because she agrees with you about Jackie?? How backward is that? HOnestly?? It is just so very one sided and myopic. This IS a show. People are dying of AIDS. Sorry, I say the person that said that SHOULD be attacked, and DESERVES it. Have you EVER seen an AIDS victim? If you have, and you are defending her, SHAME on you. This board should be fun, and a way to express our likes and dislikes about the show. Nobody should be ostracized or mocked. YOu can deny it all you want, but that is what you do. Yes, you try to be nice initially, but you all know that sooner or later, your dislike for that person will make its way..but only because we like Jackie. Its not cool, I am sorry. It is really plain wrong. Make fun of me if you like, but its the truth.

Hiya Chef,

How are you doin? I bet I don't agree with you on some stuff, but I bet we basically agree on other stuff.

Hope you can find a way to discuss this stuff less angrily. I'd hate to think you're getting your blood pressure up over this stuff. There's a lot of really cool folks in here.

Have some fun!

Hey. You know what? It does make me angry..and I am not even an angry person! I mean, I think when things are unfair, it makes my blood boil. But, thank you..I will calm down. But, I sure hope the others become less angry too because they are the ones that are making others angry. But, thanks for that, it's appreciated.

But, don't you see? There is no debate!!! All of you do just what you are doing right now! So, why would it NOT P.O. Jack? and, then you turn it around and accuse the newbies of not respecting, etc..well, go back and read how I was treated!! Please! I would try to avoid answering because I knew I was being baited, and then I would get badgered (DRB) until I answered the question that would surely not satisfy (why I like Jackie, or why I have an agenda to get people off the board, or why am I agreeing with someone..yes...that actually happened too if you read back) its just so not cool, man. Go read the posts with an objective eye, you will surely see what I am writing about. So, now, some of you are trying to get that front against the jackie likers, yet again. Saying that we can't debate, etc..I am sorry, but I was nice to those that are very hateful, but seriously, how many punches in the face should a person take before they fight back?

by the way, the personal attacks that I made are just calling people hateful. and , that is not an attack it is pointing out what is true. If people are going to behave in this vicious manner, they must be called to the carpet on it. Why, oh why does there have to be such hate?? I honestly mean it, and I would love to have an honest answer? I mean, yes, some posts were mean on both sides, but the 4 of the most hateful people here created this because they have been so vicious. They want this board to themselves and they are so territorial. Why on earth would I not have suggested yahoo??? I mean, it is clear that those four people want only to discuss their hatred (yes, hatred) for jackie. But, you know what? It's really not so much about jackie as much as it is a need to have that commonlity in order to bond. Nothing wrong with that, but once that is established, go somewhere else to discuss other things. Because, as much as you don't want to hear it, that is not what this board is for. Its not to attack people that want to write about their admiration for jackie..whether you agree or not. Its not to gang up on the three or so people that don't agree. That is not right , not one bit. It is very hurtful and unfair. I have seen how some baited me into an arguement (DRb, JC, Nici)but I would not bite. But, you would just keep on. Well, its wrong and that is not what this board is for. I have seen so many past posts where the EXACT same thing happened to others by the SAME people. It is really wrong. And, like I said earlier, to defend a person that says such horrible things about aids victims just because she hates jackie, well, that is not right at all. Especially if some of you ARE gay on this board. You should defend the dignity of those poor people because AIDS is a horror. Think outside of this board for a minute, and see why that is just so wrong. ANd, think how you would feel if people were doing this to you, if all you wanted was to discuss the show. Its' wrong, I am sorry its plain wrong.

I don't know who you are but let me tell you one thing. You have only answered the question about why you like Jackie that my wife, DrB, asked you. You have not answered the question of why you are so intent on getting others off this board nor have you give proof nor reason for why you think you know my wife well enough to say she is not a therapist. You are obsessed with her. You can't post without mentioning her. Bring your wife on. I'll be back at home by 6am and I will go f*cking head to head with you and your wife. You picked the wrong lesbian to attack and I will take you point by point. I look forward to you and your wife in the morning. I will be waiting. You have not idea who you messed with. You can spew your hate at anyone you like, but not my wife. Bring it on!!!!!!!!!!!!! I will be getting on a plane in 15 min. to head back to the USA and I will be on the computer at 6am. I look forward to our chat!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Al, let it go...he/it is not worth our time nor our dignity. He says what he says but it's no big deal. Call me! I love you and thanks for the "butchiness", kind of sexy!!!! Only five, I have a client in 14 min.

See???? This is what I mean. I DID answer your wifes post, all of them. I am not going to bring anything on. I have no desire whatsoever to write to you. Your post is scary and creepy. You are very hateful, and I don't want that in my life. BUT, you are not going to bully me off the board.

Whatever...I load in 15min. I'll call after preflight.

Did I mention I love you!!?!!?!!

OK but I have a client in 6 min. Call before if you can.

I have reported you to the bravoboard boss, and I am calling local law enforcement. I am going to request an investigation, as your post left me feeling very threatened, especially since you mentioned my wife. I plan to be very proactive in this. This will not be tolerated.

When I read your post I disagreed with what you said, but I did want to check and make sure that I had my FACTS correct before responding. I went back and checked the first posts of many of the so called "Pro Jackies" and this is what I found:
truereality 1st post may 15th 10:41am (this board) "I can not stand the anti-gay bigotry, self-righteousness and downright lying I have seen this last week because of this show any longer...It is a bigoted mindset. That is why I know this campaign is an indirect attack on gay people...liars..."

Dacia 1st post May 14th 11:59pm (this board) "You all are a bunch of crazies who have taken over the board with venom.... just look wacko now....I'm starting to think you might be locked up, which is probably a good thing because of your hateful rants..."

Jack123 1st post may 14th 8:26pm (this board) "...need to take your meds...Good Lord you people have really lost it!...Go!...Go to your Yahoo group of insanity! Please!"

Nama 1st post may 14th 6:55pm (this board) " I can't believe how synical and hateful some of you are. You scream about how Jackie Warner is the devil and has no morals and you somehow justify your hate and anger?...attack like a bunch of rabid dogs...I wish you luck with your negativity and hate"

I have only quoted a few statements from these "Pro Jackie" FIRST posts, in which, you claim they ALWAYS post "NICE THINGS"... Sure feels like "bashing" to me!!!!

(by the way, the posts are there for anyone to go back and read for themselves, and if anyone doubts that they are the first posts, they are welcome to do the research and prove it to themselves)

Now I have a question. Do you really consider these statements NICE things to say to people?!!! I will give you that they are rather nice in comparison to some of the things these same posters have written since!

I submit that you have it backward. Most of the time (not always) "Pro Jackie" posters come on this board and VICIOUSLY ATTACK the posters who are protesting her inappropriate treatment of her clients and trainers, and harass them instead of engaging in meaningful debate and dialog about the issue. They call names, they use profanity, they use personal insult/attack and they even become offended when the protesters do not respond to their posts (you figure that one out!). When attacked, people will defend themselves. I do not apologize for doing so. I (and many other protesters here) have said it before, but will repeat it again, I welcome CIVIL discussion and debate.

Chefdaddy, please note that, unlike you, I said "most of the time". You are one of the few "Pro Jackies" who did not come on the board with vicious attacks. I have appreciated it too, it has been a breath of fresh air (I am certainly not used to it)! But it seems like you are starting to take discussion and debate, which this forum is supposed to be about, personally (and unless someone is in agreement with you, you perceive it as "attack"). I am perfectly willing to agree to disagree, and be at peace with you. You have as much right to your opinion and to be on this board as I do. Not so?

See what? Alex called you on you crap and now you aren't willing to point by point with her about what you call rude and hateful? She will chew you up and spit you out. She is very protective and very much for me. Why would you say I am not a therapist? Because I stand my ground and don't let others like you and Jack123 walk all over me? Because I ask you why you are so desirous of us "squatters" moving to another board and website? Because you start crying before you answer a question fully?

I'll ask again: Why do you think Lisa lied and Jackie didn't?

Why do you think that a person in business is OK in making sexual advances toward an employee? All being an adult is not a legally sound answer so I want to know, if I grabbed your balls for my own enjoyment and I was your boss, would that be OK? It was just in good fun and we had been drinking... Is that OK?

You have a growth in the middle of your forehead and Jackie and her secretary are sitting in the office and laughing at you. No one else is around. But someone hears? Should they both apologize? Why or why not?

Answer me these and I will let it be with you. Now for Alex...I can't be so sure. She is pretty pissed at how you attacked me and my profession. She tends to be very protective and if you think I was rude last night for asking pertinent questions, wait til Alex asks you questions. She is relentless....and that is why I love her so....

No, you are right on some of the things that you mention, no doubt about it. I have to say though, the people that were mean had just about enough because they were attacked from the get go. I dont think its right, but I can see why they were upset. Look, I feel better about defending their posts over a post that says people with aids deserve it. I do. I think its fine if people disagree with me. but, if you read back, you can see it was more than that. I won't discuss the attack that I just had on me. My wife is actually speaking to an intake worker at our local sheriffs office about it right now. She is a better speaker than I am. but, that was threatening and my wife is REALLY freaked out. I had to calm her down, she thinks somewhow that person can find us. But, we are requesting a an investigation. That said, you are right on a lot of what you just wrote. I am not going to disagree with you. But, the four or more jackie likers take it too far. They gang up on people, its wrong, just wrong. You are very nice, and I appreciate all that you wrote. I agree with you on a lot of it, but I also think some of the hate posting from the other camp happened because they felt attacked. right or wrong. It seems like they just woosh in and gang up and attack, and it wrong. so, the other people go batty and post the posts that attack because they are attacked. I appreciate your post though. Well thought out

You brought your 'wife' into this, Alex didn't. I felt EXTREMELY threatened by that and told my wife and she responded. I wonder if I look good in orange? It's not really my color but black and white is. No one made any treats to you except to tell you to back up your words and be willing to go word for word in your attempt to silence those who might be costing you your job, -----!!!!!! Others can find ISP addresses as well. I know yours and that is why I love talking with you. Make sure you tell the authorities who you REALLY are.

who is obsessing over who? I'm seriously starting to get worried about your preoccupation with me....seriously.

You know I have been sitting back and reading all this and once in a while I will make a comment. I do like the show and I like Jackie. My thing is I have read on the Internet, in magazines, on MySpace, etc.. That these guys are told what to say and it is edited to make more interesting. They are actors and not real people most of them. How can we get this upset at each other. It is a show and we all need to calm down!

I agree Shadow that we need to calm down. However, the vicious personal attacks have got to stop.

Wait....There is a SECOND goat-cat?!!!
What is this world coming to?!!!
Mommakelly, don't even talk to me about catnip!

Hmmmm......
I just thought of a new money making venture...
GOAT-CAT NIP! TADA!!!!
Now I can quit my day job!!!
(and I won't ever have to dust again! yeah, like I do now!)

that's really funny, I never even thought of doing a google till you said it...lol. The Healthboards, atkins and upatsix (parrots) are me, but not sure who the other ones are. Apparently there is someone else who has a Kia in their life.

Atkins-I"m happy to report I've got my triathlon shape back and I'm going to be competing in a brazilian jui jitsu tournament in a few months! (that's after 4 ankle surgeries in 5 years) OH sorry...jackie doens't know anything about injuries...sorry.

Healthboards-I'm quite happy to share my experiences with others. If I can help someone, great. My experiences give me great insight into my (gasp) Couseling Psychology degree, M.A. (also working on Neuroscience PhD)

UpAtSix- well it's been said...I do love my bird.

There ya go jackie123...are you going to stalk me on MySpace now?

Ive seen you treat chefdaddy that way. So whats the difference?

please quote me where I said gay people deserve AIDS. You can't, because I didn't. Funny you sound a lot like my stalker. Go back and read my posts, tihs time....try to comprehend them. You obviously missed it the first few times.

chefdaddy
Please help me to understand when and how I "baited" you (or attempted to) into an argument. To my knowledge I have always responded to your posts in a respectful manner and have always stated clearly that you had as much right to your opinion and to be on this board as I do. Unless my having an opposing view is "baiting" you, I truly do not understand your statement.

You have gone too far by inferring that I'm someone else to disregard what I've been saying. You had best check your information before jumping to any conclusions or by outright lying.

How dare you? I have not personally attacked you in any way. I have argued with what you've said, but I think on a very low keyed level. Obviously you can't reply or defend your position that I've questioned, so the only thing you can do is try and infer I'm just someone else to attack me.

I have no clue whatsoever why you earlier said "Liam" in response to my posts and I have no clue why you'd continue that accusation; other than out of desperation.

You want to attack me, then attack ME. Do not accuse Liam or anyone else for what I've said.

Hey Swiss...where have you been?

Whatever you say, LIAM.

You rang?

ROFL You are so totally hopeless. If you need to make me into Liam, then so be it. You obviously can't understand there's several people who don't agree with Jackie's actions, so to you they must all be the same person.

I'll have to inform my husband that my name now is Liam, plus all my co-workers; plus the several charities I work for. ROFL Now that will make them laugh.

Allow me to look, but so far, I found this:

If people have unsafe sex, then they make their bed. I mean I don't stand on a street corner and shout "good for you, you immoral puke" really I don't. But I"m not going to spend a lot of time feeling compassion for someone who makes bad decisions. Why should I? I'm not talking about ONE bad decision. I'm talking about several...which to me..means a character flaw. Thems the breaks.


Thems the breaks???? Are you joking????? So, if people get sick because they did not have safe sex, you feel no compassion?? What is wrong with your compass? Do you know that a lot of people are promiscuous because of abuse? There are a lot of underlying issues for this. So, they deserve no compassion??? I am sorry, I feel that is a character flaw.

I am hopeless. I think that is a personal attack. Aren't we supposed to refrain from those, Liam?

I am not assuming...you are Liam. Your ISP is Liams ISP.